As another point of reference on Hoosiers, most 944 Cup guys would run them for up to maybe 20 heat cycles but they would fall off significantly after about 10 heat cycles. The problem with that is that guys with big money (or winning contingencies) can go buy fresh tires at 10 heat cycles. The result is that the fast or rich guys stay at the front.

The Toyo is more consistent over a longer period which I think levels the playing field a bit better.

One other small concern with Hoosiers is suspension setup and wear. I think you can get away with a softer setup, aluminum control arms, etc more easily on Toyos. When you add the grip of Hoosiers, you might see more suspension/ball joint failures.

GRM's write up on the R1R does make it sound like it has the normal characteristics of a street tire, (heat up in long sweepers making it lose grip) I wonder if shaving would help with the heating up issue? It would be nice to test them.

To those making the choice for us, I hope that lap times will not play into the decision, ONLY, longevity, cost and safety. Lap times has NOTHING to do with good fun close racing as long as we are all on the same tire and (close power to weight ratio) With a 40 car field and close racing through out the field, 2-4 seconds a lap faster or slower makes NO difference as long as it's the same for all of us.

I would be surprised if Michael Maduske is very far off on his 7-10 heat cycles for the sm6 before they are gone or not competitive with a new set, especially for those of you that drive mostly in a drift or "sideways" It will be good to hear from Greg Fordahl on his experience with, heat cycling out.

At approx. $700 a set, with 15 heat cycles, that calculates to $46.66 per session or heat cycles, not including mount balance etc...which is the same for any tire. So if somebody asks you to take them for a ride, ask them for $50 and you might break even!

One more thing and I am done, the stickier the tire, the more brakes you will use and basically more wear on suspension etc...So the cost goes up for other parts as well. Our newest cars are 23 years old now and need all of the help they can get to not heat up and or break!

Thanks again,
norm

Several years ago, SCCA Spec-944, in Arizona, was using a Goodyear tire as the preferred tire in their series (just before they went to Toyo's as a spec tire). I do not recall what tire it was but assume it was American made.

Norm, do you recall what tire it was? I called Doug Nelson to find out. He is going to try to find the Goodyear supplier that he used and call regarding them. I will keep everyone posted.

If Goodyear has tires, Doug said that they would last better than Hoosiers but not quite as well as Toyo's, of course. The secrete was to heat cycle the tires and let them sit for a minimum of 24 hours, or better for a week or so. Without that, they would wear out quickly.

Jim Foxx

norman#99 wrote:


The tires GRM tested were shaved to 3/32

Something to consider with the R1R test is that it sounds as if they were testing at an autocross.
If this is true then these tires may not be any good for road racing.
This looks like a tire that Speed World Challenge used a few years ago.
If this is the case we want to stay away from those they were terrible. (personal experience)

Guys, thanks for the research, and hard work on following through on things. All good info, and continues to show issues with any option. My heart is with the +7 option, but there are practical issues with thatoption as well, and considerations that are over my head in this matter. I have passed on the opinions here, and my own, with as much research as possible, to the national office. Things are more complex than when we started into this, and even involve other classes affected by this issue.

The National Office is following this thread, and your opinions are being heard, and considered among many issues. In the end, whatever comes down is a short term solution to an unforseen, and bad problem, without a clean solution. Individual regions can stick with the RA-1 so long as they are able, as none of the considerations I've heard takes them off the table. I am told a decision, and explanation, will come before the week is out, from the National Office.

Thanks again for all the constructive input here, there's a lot of well placed passion for the class seen.